Editorial
Interview
In conversation with Caio Rosa, photographer Eustáquio Neves talks about his artistic journey
Caio Rosa
20 Jun 2023, 4:15 pm
It’s curious that it was an African researcher who first told me about Eustáquio Neves (an artist represented by Vermelho gallery). I was still taking my first steps in photography when I met Cameroonian curator Bonaventure Ndikung in 2016 or 2017 during a visit he made to Rio de Janeiro. Very helpful, he said it would be disruptive to my research to know Eustáquio’s work—and that’s exactly what happened.
Years later, when I moved to São Paulo, I was able to meet him personally through Nô Martins, an artist and friend we have in common, and since then, we have become quite close.
Born in Juatuba, a metropolitan region of Belo Horizonte, in 1955, Eustáquio Neves now lives and works in the historic city of Diamantina. Another connection between us arises from that, as part of my family is from there. My father, who is a musician and writer, and I are planning a trip to learn more about my grandfather whom I never knew, who has a long history that we know very little about—there was a kind of forced exodus, and the white part of my family is still known in the city.
I greatly admire Eustáquio for his work and worldview, which have been game-changers for my career and many other artists around the world. It is a great pleasure to engage in conversations with the master and have the opportunity to revisit his photography and bring up issues that I consider important for the artistic and cultural discourse in Brazil.
Above: Eustáquio Neves, detail from the artwork "Série Arturos", 1994
Eustáquio Neves, "Série objetivação do corpo", 1999
Caio Rosa: Eustáquio, starting from your youth, what paths led you to envision yourself as an artist? How did your background in chemistry come into your life, and how does it still relate to your creative process?
Eustáquio Neves: In my youth, like many other restless young people, my mind was filled with a universe of things, desires, achievements, and possibilities that I aspired to. I wanted to be a musician, and I had what I now consider more of a study group or an experiment rather than a band. I played classical guitar for a little over a year, I enjoyed theater, painting, and saw photography as something more distant. I collected records, books, and comics, and I was raised by many very strong mothers. I also attended a public school that was very important to me in my childhood. The connection between chemistry and what I do in photography has more to do with my interest in experimentation rather than the processes themselves, but it does contribute to these processes as I have some knowledge and zero fear of making mistakes.
Eustáquio Neves, "Retrato falado", 2020
CR: Your work delves deeply into the genealogy of your family, rescuing and even creating a visual, symbolic, and affective memory of relatives—as in the series “Retrato falado” (Spoken Portrait)*—and the cultural body that surrounds you, which fills a common gap for a large part of the Afro-Brazilian population. What is the importance of this change in the construction and reconstruction of our image, previously guided by a white and colonial gaze, and in recent years by artists like you and many others?
EN: You practically answered what I would say, but of course, what fuels my work are concerns that do not set aside indignation and questioning about the failed project of erasing the memories and culture of Afro-descendant peoples. When I started in photography, a little over forty years ago, because I didn’t hear anything that wasn’t from this place in which I had no interest, in which I didn’t see myself represented, with few exceptions, I ended up going down this path that almost always ends up speaking about myself and my origins, in other words, self-representation to bring forth the issues of us, Black people.
*In “Retrato falado” (2019), the winning project of the ZUM/IMS Photography Grant 2019, he reconstructed the portrait of his grandfather, whom he did not know and for whom there were no images in the family albums, based on descriptions from relatives and analog and digital resources of photographic manipulation.
Eustáquio Neves, "Série Outros Navios 2", 2020
CR: I believe this is a good opportunity to address certain concerns we have already discussed: a significant part of the construction of Black identity in Brazil is linked to a Bahian/Nagô matrix, reinforced in the past by photographers like Pierre Verger or Mário Cravo Neto, diminishing or perhaps even erasing over the last five/six decades the importance of other branches of Afro-Brazilian cultural diversity and their cosmogonies, such as the Afro-Mineiran matrix, for example. What are your thoughts on these points, and how does your work contribute to the process of rewriting the history and photography of Black people in our country?
EN: We know how diverse our country is, and this diversity also exists within Black communities from different places in Brazil. We are formed by different peoples from this forced migration from Africa to here, but there is always a bond that unites us—I have experienced this even outside Brazil, in the United States and Africa, for example.
Thus, I see that there is no barrier between one region and another. There are, of course, peculiarities and ways of doing things, but I think it is the collective imagination and this DNA of resistance that moves us. Here we are, two people from different generations, discussing something we have inherited, which is to resist and live with dignity, to have a voice and rights.
It is worth recalling an important movement, of which I am a part, of Black authors that emerged in the 1990s in Minas Gerais, where we already had Leda Martins, and subsequently, no less important, we have Rui Moreira in dance, Gil Amâncio in music, Edimilson de Almeida and Ricardo Aleixo in literature, Jorge dos Anjos in the visual arts. This movement, which was not planned, was recently well-remembered by Ricardo Aleixo. If I’m not mistaken, he called it “Encruzilhadas” (Crossroads).
Eustáquio Neves, "Série Arturos", 1994
CR: It has been several decades since the field of photography has dealt with numerous discussions centered around the digital revolution, and currently, we are faced with the creation of images through artificial intelligence, with its infinite possibilities and controversies. How does your work, which appropriates various layers and traverses many techniques and processes between capture, manipulation, printing, including drawing and painting, relate to these new forms of image production?
EN: Today’s new technologies, as they could not be otherwise, are much more sophisticated because they have emerged from the precariousness that creators sometimes face in expressing themselves. I work on the edge of precariousness even though I have access to more sophisticated mechanisms. Manipulating images is nothing new; an instant photo in itself is a manipulation of reality. I see all of this only as new tools.
Eustáquio Neves, "Série aberto pela aduana 1", 2020
CR: I know that music is very important in your development as an artist. Could you talk a bit about that connection? Have you ever thought about or do you have plans to produce something along those lines in the future?
EN: I don’t have grand aspirations, but it ends up being a refuge for me from time to time. I have returned to studying my instruments. [Note: Although he didn’t mention it, his great hobby is playing the guitar, rock n’ roll!]
Caio Rosa
was born in 1992 in the western zone of Rio de Janeiro. He is a photographer and researcher, currently living and working in São Paulo. His studies explore methodologies and strategies for accessing the divine and intangible realms through his cultural experience, using photography, music, video, and installation. He is the creator and host of the program “Rio Doce” on NTS Radio (London), where he explores traditional and contemporary Afro-diasporic music and its connections worldwide.
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